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V12 Bank Angles, Balance, Even/Odd Fire, Etc. http://gemellocattivo.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=352 |
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Author: | cribbj [ Sun Oct 06, 2019 6:33 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: V12 Bank Angles, Balance, Even/Odd Fire, Etc. |
I remember something about a big bore 4 cyl Honda that was built to comply with the 4 cylinder requirement. The ring pack on that thing must have been really unique. |
Author: | mk e [ Sun Oct 06, 2019 6:46 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: V12 Bank Angles, Balance, Even/Odd Fire, Etc. |
Here it is: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_NR A 120 degree v12 is effectively the same idea |
Author: | MerlinTech [ Mon Oct 07, 2019 11:38 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: V12 Bank Angles, Balance, Even/Odd Fire, Etc. |
You guys are making my brain hurt, it's a good brain but I am careful not to kill it. |
Author: | cribbj [ Mon Oct 07, 2019 12:15 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: V12 Bank Angles, Balance, Even/Odd Fire, Etc. |
FoaTech wrote: You guys are making my brain hurt, it's a good brain but I am careful not to kill it. My head hurts too this morning, however it might have more to do with the bottle of Cab I polished off last night. Still trying to figure out how Honda did the rings on those oval pistons..... |
Author: | TheDarkSideOfWill [ Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:44 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: V12 Bank Angles, Balance, Even/Odd Fire, Etc. |
Is the Testarossa engine a boxer 12 or 180 degree V12? |
Author: | mk e [ Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:00 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: V12 Bank Angles, Balance, Even/Odd Fire, Etc. |
TheDarkSideOfWill wrote: Is the Testarossa engine a boxer 12 or 180 degree V12? Yup, it sure is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOILZ_D3aRg |
Author: | MerlinTech [ Tue Oct 08, 2019 6:37 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: V12 Bank Angles, Balance, Even/Odd Fire, Etc. |
cribbj wrote: FoaTech wrote: You guys are making my brain hurt, it's a good brain but I am careful not to kill it. My head hurts too this morning, however it might have more to do with the bottle of Cab I polished off last night. Still trying to figure out how Honda did the rings on those oval pistons..... Yeeaaaahhhhhh, Uhmmmm, no. I am just stopping on that one. |
Author: | TheDarkSideOfWill [ Tue Oct 08, 2019 9:54 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: V12 Bank Angles, Balance, Even/Odd Fire, Etc. |
mk e wrote: TheDarkSideOfWill wrote: Is the Testarossa engine a boxer 12 or 180 degree V12? Yup, it sure is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOILZ_D3aRg Which is it? Not so sure that's the video you meant to link... |
Author: | mk e [ Wed Oct 09, 2019 5:15 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: V12 Bank Angles, Balance, Even/Odd Fire, Etc. |
mk e wrote: TheDarkSideOfWill wrote: Which is it? Not so sure that's the video you meant to link... The 2 names mean the same thing so the answer is "yes", which was the point of the video. The word V normally implies an angle less than 180 and at 180 it becomes a "boxer"...but its still a 2 bank engine with the angle between the banks 180, so 180 V12 is still correct in my view. I think when you say boxer I think split cases vs a V engine where I think single block....it doesn't have to be that way and I don't think there is any clear definition that dictates 1 name or the other. When I started building the frankenferrari I used to joke I assumed the ferrari engineers were as lazy as me so when they were asked to make a flat 12 (see that, yet another name for the same thing) they pulled the V12 drawing, crossed out 60, wrote 180 and sent it to the shop so I expected the parts to interchange....I knew BB or TR head do fit a 308 block but I didn't realize all 3 were a newer design topend and not back compatible |
Author: | TheDarkSideOfWill [ Wed Oct 09, 2019 9:17 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: V12 Bank Angles, Balance, Even/Odd Fire, Etc. |
A boxer has 180 degree split crank throws... a 180 degree V doesn't. So in the search, I found the article that graphic came from: https://jalopnik.com/its-time-you-knew- ... 1825246413 He claims the Ferrari is a 180 V, not a boxer... the Berlinetta Boxer doesn't have a boxer engine. Funky. He also says the Porsche flat 12 in the 917 wasn't a boxer either. I guess since a 2 bank 12 will have perfect primary balance no matter what the bank angle is, there's no advantage to the extra complexity of a boxer. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_engine Subaru (and I assume Porsche) happens to throw main bearings in between paired cylinders, but each pair has pins that are 180 degrees out from each other. This wouldn't be the case on a 180 degree V. I think VW's only have three mains, so they're in the split crank throw category. ETA: switched to a better graphic |
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